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 Subject :Part 97 question re:third part traffic.. 2011-12-23- 02:17:19 
KV4I
Member
Joined: 2011-12-17- 08:30:12
Posts: 51
Location: New Smyrna Beach, FL
Forum : General
Topic : Part 97 question re:third part traffic

It seems the most efficient way to provide Digital EmComm to a served agency would be to connect their PCs to an HSMM-MESH node.

Agency staff could use their web browsers to send WebMail over the HSMM-MESH network. However, when it becomes necessary to boost power beyond acceptable Part 15 levels, Part 97 rules apply.

§ 97.115 Third party communications states (in part)

(b) The third party may participate in stating the message where:

    (1) The control operator is present at the control point and is continuously monitoring and supervising the third party's participation;

(c) No station may transmit third party communications while being automatically controlled except a station transmitting a RTTY or data emission. So, my questions are:

- Can these agency created emails be transmitted under automatic control without a control operator "continuously monitoring and supervising"?

- How do control operators meet the requirement to continuously monitor participation of third parties when the third parties are generating emails on their PCs destined to go out over the HSMM-MESH network at power levels exceeding Part 15 limits?

Thanks and 73 Mark KV4I

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Last Edited On: 2011-12-26- 02:12:00 By KV4I for the Reason
 Subject :Re:Bad range with wrt54g.. 2011-12-21- 13:00:31 
KF5KWE
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Joined: 2011-09-06- 19:18:00
Posts: 7
Location
Forum : Problems & Answers
Topic : Bad range with wrt54g

Ok I flashes DD-WRT, did some testing and it looks like my router is busted. The signal improves non-at-all with or without antennas. Will need to grab another WRT54g and rp-tnc connectors to figure out if it's not the antennas. Thanks KD5MFW anyways.
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 Subject :Flash back to stock WRT54G firmware(or any other firmware).. 2011-12-21- 08:56:45 
KF5KWE
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Joined: 2011-09-06- 19:18:00
Posts: 7
Location
Forum : Problems & Answers
Topic : Flash back to stock WRT54G firmware(or any other firmware)

Log in with putty over 192.168.1.1:2222, have to set static ip of 192.168.1.2.

Thanks to KB8QWN using tfp to upload a firmware before the router boots is easy with these steps.

  1. Connect over SSH to 192.168.1.1:2222, from static IP of 192.168.1.2. I used putty.
  2. Run the commands:
  3. nvram set boot_wait=on
  4. nvram set boot_time=10
  5. nvram commit
  6. Download tfp.exe from the Downloads here.
  7. Select 192.168.1.1 and your bin file.
  8. In your SSH terminal window run the command, reboot.
  9. Switch over to tfp.exe and upload the bin.
  10. Green light means you can close tfp.exe and your SSH terminal.
  11. Wait a few good minutes and then browse to the routers IP, most likely 192.168.1.1(Linksys default, and DD-WRT)

Figured I would share. Since some may need to boot a more complete firmware for testing stuff.

For instance, my issue thread here about range. Now I know my router is busted or something as DD-WRT provides the ability to test an antenna more visually than the HSMM firmware.

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Last Edited On: 2011-12-21- 12:57:46 By KF5KWE for the Reason
 Subject :Re:Determining maximum line of sight.. 2011-12-20- 10:28:21 
KV4I
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Joined: 2011-12-17- 08:30:12
Posts: 51
Location: New Smyrna Beach, FL
Forum : General
Topic : Determining maximum line of sight

That's a great utility. There's so much useful information at HSMM-MESH.org that I haven't found it all yet. Thanks a lot, Rick. 73 Mark KV4I
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 Subject :Re:Determining maximum line of sight.. 2011-12-20- 03:54:22 
NG5V
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Joined: 2010-01-18- 23:06:23
Posts: 43
Location
Forum : General
Topic : Determining maximum line of sight

Mark, That is a great start and you are correct about line of sight. We already have a more complete solution in the web links. Use Web links > Propagation and mapping > Hey whats that profiler. It takes a click or two before you understand how to draw profiles. My suggestion is to search for a street address or place then pinch/drag the map around without clicking anything. Zoom in until you have an exact location. Click there. It becomes location one. Repeat for location two and then look at the top of the page for the profile. Put in 2450mhz for the frequency and then click once somwhere outside the map to draw the fade zones. Click backspace to remove last map point if you make an error. To simulate a building top or tower at either end, click the elevation and put in +50 or similar to get add an AGL to the actual elevation. This model uses Google maps and arial views plus the hyper accurate SRTM shuttle elevation data. The only thing not accounted for is trees and contruction that took place after the shuttle SRTM radar mission. It's free and it is pretty easy to use. Enjoy. Rick NG5V
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 Subject :Determining maximum line of sight.. 2011-12-20- 02:20:20 
KV4I
Member
Joined: 2011-12-17- 08:30:12
Posts: 51
Location: New Smyrna Beach, FL
Forum : General
Topic : Determining maximum line of sight

Working on my first HSMM-MESH deployment, I needed to know what was the maximum distance I could hope to accomplish.

Since there's no point in setting up nodes where they couldn't possibly see each other, I wanted to know what was the maximum line of sight.

As Galileo observed, you can only see so far due to the earth's curvature, but how do you determine that distance. Well, I found a tool that answers that question.

Visit http://boatsafe.com/tools/horizon.htm and enter the height of your antenna and the web page will tell you the distance to the horizon.

Of course, you may not be able to see that far due to other factors and if the second node is higher than the horizon you may be able to see further, but for me, it's a useful guide.

73 Mark KV4I

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Last Edited On: 2011-12-20- 03:10:11 By KV4I for the Reason clarity
 Subject :Re:Multi-directional node implementation.. 2011-12-19- 02:12:31 
KV4I
Member
Joined: 2011-12-17- 08:30:12
Posts: 51
Location: New Smyrna Beach, FL
Forum : Hardware
Topic : Multi-directional node implementation

Jim, Thanks for the tip about the Orbit. I'm still working out which antennae and packaging will best suit my needs so my node is in doors on a desk with stock antennae and powered off. After I get it up and running, I'll send you the coordinates for the node. I'm curious about the TX power setting. HSMM-MESH shows my current WRT54GL ver 1.1 TX power setting at 19dBm (about 79 mw) which is the maximum option in the firmware. I've read that the hardware maximum is much higher. Does the firmware stop at 19 dBm because this is the optimum maximum for HSMM-MESH or is there some other reason why my set up is limited to 19? Thanks for your help and 73, Mark KV4I
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 Subject :Re:Multi-directional node implementation.. 2011-12-18- 17:37:22 
K5KTF
Admin
Joined: 2010-01-18- 23:04:04
Posts: 266
Location: 5' from this webserver
  
Forum : Hardware
Topic : Multi-directional node implementation

Alot of times, we will use an Orbit exterior sprinkler controller box, which is about $25 at your local home improvement store. I have had one up on a 40' mast for over a year, and it still is in good shape. I will be bringing the node down soon for upgrades (replace the TV rotor it sits on, adding more mast to gain some height, etc), so I will be able to see how it has fared from the inside. If you would like, I can add your node to our google map. Id just need the Lat Lon (in XX.XXXXXX format preferably), so that anyone else near you can see and try and connect. You can see a link to the map once you are logged in, at the bottom of the HSMM-MESH Info section of the menu to the left. 73 and GL! Jim K5KTF
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B-) Jim K5KTF EM10bm Cedar Park, TX :star:
 Subject :Re:Multi-directional node implementation.. 2011-12-18- 16:36:47 
KV4I
Member
Joined: 2011-12-17- 08:30:12
Posts: 51
Location: New Smyrna Beach, FL
Forum : Hardware
Topic : Multi-directional node implementation

Thanks, Jim. I just stumbled across an example of a rootenna coupled with an external omnidirectional antenna at http://www.n5oom.org/hsmm/rootenna_project.htm So far, I've got my WRT54GL flashed with HSMM-MESH and now I'm trying to decide how I want to package everything. Since I need a weatherproof container anyway, the rootenna is appealing. I'm a Ham and a retired MCSE so I've got networking experience and I really enjoy combining these two aspects of my life. I've been discussing HSMM-MESH with some of our local ARES members and I'm hoping there will be enough interest to be able to put a mesh together locally. I appreciate your help. 73 Mark KV4I
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 Subject :Re:Multi-directional node implementation.. 2011-12-18- 16:02:28 
K5KTF
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Joined: 2010-01-18- 23:04:04
Posts: 266
Location: 5' from this webserver
  
Forum : Hardware
Topic : Multi-directional node implementation

You could use a rootenna, or 2, back to back, etc. You would just need to run (high quality) coax from the rootenna that doesnt have the node inside. Let us know what you come up with. We are always eager to hear how everyone actually uses HSMM-Mesh. 73 Jim K5KTF
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B-) Jim K5KTF EM10bm Cedar Park, TX :star:
 Subject :Re:Multi-directional node implementation.. 2011-12-18- 15:34:18 
KV4I
Member
Joined: 2011-12-17- 08:30:12
Posts: 51
Location: New Smyrna Beach, FL
Forum : Hardware
Topic : Multi-directional node implementation

I see. I was kind of partial to a rootenna but I guess I'll have to use a different approach if I want to use more than one antenna. Thanks for clearing things up. 73 Mark KV4I
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 Subject :Re:Multi-directional node implementation.. 2011-12-18- 15:27:22 
K5KTF
Admin
Joined: 2010-01-18- 23:04:04
Posts: 266
Location: 5' from this webserver
  
Forum : Hardware
Topic : Multi-directional node implementation

That picture is only an example of how things work. The REAL node map is http://hsmm-mesh.org/googlemapped-mesh-nodes.html , where people have sent me their Lat/Lon and I added them. My one node on a 40' pole has a 24dBi dish and a 12dBi omni, one to each port. You can put any combo of antennae on, however you want. Could be 2 omnis, 2 directionals, a yagi and a dish, etc. Whatever works for you. 73 K5KTF
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B-) Jim K5KTF EM10bm Cedar Park, TX :star:
 Subject :Multi-directional node implementation.. 2011-12-18- 08:44:23 
KV4I
Member
Joined: 2011-12-17- 08:30:12
Posts: 51
Location: New Smyrna Beach, FL
Forum : Hardware
Topic : Multi-directional node implementation

The MESH Visual at http://hsmm-mesh.org/visual-of-a-mesh-network.html shows each node is able to access two or more other nodes each in a different direction. How was this accomplished?

Does each node have a single omnidirectional antenna? two directional antennae on one WRT54G? more than one WRT54G?

Thanks for any insight you can offer.

73 Mark KV4I


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 Subject :Re:Request that HSMM-Mesh firmware be created for Ubiquiti Products.. 2011-12-09- 17:18:54 
K1OQ
Member
Joined: 2011-09-13- 22:49:23
Posts: 6
Location: Vancouver, WA
Forum : Hardware
Topic : Request that HSMM-Mesh firmware be created for Ubiquiti Products

I was wondering if anyone in the firmware devlopment community has asked Ubiquiti for assistnce in porting the HSMM-Mesh firmware over to their products. With 700,000+ Hams and many of them in ARES groups with interest in HSMM-Mesh, it would seem to me that they might be interested in another market for their products. Just a thought!
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 Subject :Re:another south austin node - KF5KWE.. 2011-12-08- 03:21:20 
kf5mfl
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Joined: 2011-11-24- 18:35:27
Posts: 4
Location
Forum : Austin
Topic : another south austin node - KF5KWE

All three of mine are up 24/7 with battery backup.  I doubt you will be able to hit any of mine easily. All 3 are running with the stock 54GL antennas, indoors, in a top floor apartment.  There is also a slight hill between our locations along with the usual obstacles.  (trees, buildings, etc.)

I plan, in the next few months, to acquire a few high gain antennas for all my nodes along with moving them higher in the apartment.

73

KF5MFL

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 Subject :another south austin node - KF5KWE.. 2011-12-07- 13:48:54 
KF5KWE
Member
Joined: 2011-09-06- 19:18:00
Posts: 7
Location
Forum : Austin
Topic : another south austin node - KF5KWE

I'm on the google map of nodes already, and the node is running pretty much 24/7. However as of right now I'm troubleshooting some range issues and you would have to be pretty close I imagine to link up. Just putting it here that I am active and working to link up with more nodes.

On that note I noticed there are a few nodes nearby, the KF5MFL and SAMC node's are about ~3mi away from my qth and I was curious to see if the operators of those nodes could link up with mine or if they are actively running 24/7. I'd hate to find out I'm working towards linking up and find out the node is currently down or inactive for now. 

http://hsmm-mesh.org/googlemapped-mesh-nodes.html is the map I'm talking about, mine located around the intersection of I-35 and wm. cannon. 


I really dig the whole multimedia mesh network run by HAMs so I would love to see this project explode in popularity and have a rich network of links. SO I will be doing everything I can to help it spread, unfortunately purchasing many nodes and getting permission to install them in spots that bridge current nodes isn't feasible for me and kind of against the point of HAM radio.(IMHO)


So I will be lurking around, trying to fix my nodes range issue, and await for any opportunities to help. BTW I have the svn repo working and compiling builds(i've made a version of the firmware with code customizations)


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 Subject :Re:Bad range with wrt54g.. 2011-12-07- 13:39:52 
KF5KWE
Member
Joined: 2011-09-06- 19:18:00
Posts: 7
Location
Forum : Problems & Answers
Topic : Bad range with wrt54g

Unfortunately no, but I plan on doing some more testing tomorrow when it's light after work. I guess I will have to lug the dish out there on the lawn to eliminate the possibility of the window affecting it. I can't think of anything else to work on for testing/fixing the range..
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 Subject :Re:Bad range with wrt54g.. 2011-12-07- 13:23:54 
KD5MFW
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Joined: 2010-01-18- 23:02:11
Posts: 104
Location
Forum : Problems & Answers
Topic : Bad range with wrt54g

If you have a PC running windows, you can download inSSIDer from metageek. A google search will turn up a link to inSSIDer. This will use the wi-fi card in your pc to show wi-fi signals. It is super useful. Do you have a PC that runs windows with wi-fi capability? If so, you have the basis for a piece of test gear. -Glenn KD5MFW
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 Subject :Re:Bad range with wrt54g.. 2011-12-07- 12:42:57 
KF5KWE
Member
Joined: 2011-09-06- 19:18:00
Posts: 7
Location
Forum : Problems & Answers
Topic : Bad range with wrt54g

Still no change with a standard build of hsmm, I don't have any other way to test wifi.
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 Subject :Re:Bad range with wrt54g.. 2011-12-07- 12:16:35 
KD5MFW
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Joined: 2010-01-18- 23:02:11
Posts: 104
Location
Forum : Problems & Answers
Topic : Bad range with wrt54g

The power out of the WRT54G is low. I would also try to check the connectors that were changed. They are hard to solder, even if you have experience. The BNC connectors will probably work, but check their microwave ratings - most go to a N, SMA / RSMA or TNC / RTNC for microwave, not BNC connectors. Antenna selection is on one of the configuration pages presented by the firmware. You can select, left, right or both (for diversity) mode. I would try a standard build of the firmware. Without that, we have no baseline for testing. It is entirely possible for the wi-fi part of the device to be off or easily misconfigured and that could be the problem. Let us know what you find. -Glenn KD5MFW
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